'Donald Trump is on a major losing streak' - attorney on Trump Organization conviction

Record ID: 1701169

  • Title: 'Donald Trump is on a major losing streak' - attorney on Trump Organization conviction
  • Date: 6th December 2022
  • Summary: NEW YORK, NEW YORK, UNITED STATES (DECEMBER 6, 2022) (REUTERS) (SOUNDBITE) (English) ATTORNEY, MITCHELL EPNER, SAYING: "With regard to today's guilty convictions, a jury of 12 found beyond a reasonable doubt that the Trump Organization committed tax fraud knowingly and intentionally by mischaracterizing the payments to Allen Weisselberg to cheat the government out of the taxes that were due. This is something that is now established in a court of law as a fact. We also know beyond a doubt that Donald Trump had, in his possession, at least 100 documents that were labeled as 'secret' or higher at a time he said that he had zero. That is something that if it were any other individual in the United States would have them already in a jail cell." WHITE FLASH (SOUNDBITE) (English) ATTORNEY, MITCHELL EPNER, SAYING: "Donald Trump never had to give an explanation for this scheme. The Trump Organization's explanation was that this was all Allen Weisselberg's doing. He set up a way that he could cheat on his taxes, and it was for his own benefit, not for the benefit of the Trump Organization. And the jury unanimously found beyond a reasonable doubt that that was not true, and that, at least in part, this was done to benefit the Trump Organization. And the way it benefited the Trump Organization was it allowed them to get away with paying people like Weisselberg less than they would have otherwise had to pay him in order to give him the benefits that he was able to get on the free market." WHITE FLASH (SOUNDBITE) (English) ATTORNEY, MITCHELL EPNER, SAYING: "They were charged with tax fraud and fraud. The Trump Organization was found guilty on all counts. Allen Weisselberg, who is the former CFO and still an employee of the Trump Organization, had previously pled guilty. And the ramifications are since you can't send an organization to jail, there will be a fine which may be as much as $1.6 million. That's the least of it. The two other likely big ramifications are, number one, this is probably an event of default on any loan that any part of the Trump Organization has taken out, which means that any bank could call in that loan. And since interest rates have gone up, any bank that has a loan out to the Trump Organization at let's say 3% or 4%, may want to call that in, because if they just lent the same money to somebody else right now, they could lend it out at 8%. So this might require the Trump Organization to scramble to refinance a lot of loans. It also means that the federal government can, but doesn't mean they have to, but the federal government now can break every contract that they have with the Trump Organization, including any contracts for the Secret Service, to stay at Mar-a-Lago or continue to rent a full floor at Trump Tower. There have been a lot of stories about how those rents have been well above market rates and have put millions of dollars each year into the Trump Organization's coffers." WHITE FLASH (SOUNDBITE) (English) ATTORNEY, MITCHELL EPNER, SAYING: "Donald Trump has been having one of the worst losing streaks since the old days of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers when they went 0-23 (0-26). He is on a major losing streak. He is facing not only the guilty (verdict) for the Trump Organization, all of his attempts to stand in the way of the special counsel moving forward in the criminal investigation with regard to the Mar-a-Lago documents have been pushed aside. That case is going to move forward. The investigation by Fani Willis, the Fulton County district attorney down in Georgia, is moving forward. They've been able to get Mark Meadows to have to testify. Senator Lindsey Graham has had to testify. This is the part in 'Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid' where they take a look out and they see the entire Bolivian army arrayed against them." WHITE FLASH (SOUNDBITE) (English) ATTORNEY, MITCHELL EPNER, SAYING: "He says he's running for president. We'll see how that goes. That's for politicians, not a lawyer like me to figure out. Number two, the person who was originally dubbed the 'Teflon Don,' John Gotti, was eventually convicted. It took a couple of tries, but he was not only convicted, he was sentenced and he died in jail. If I were Donald Trump, I would be very concerned that that might be my fate." WHITE FLASH (SOUNDBITE) (English) ATTORNEY, MITCHELL EPNER, SAYING: "There is nothing other than the good sense of the American people that bars Donald Trump from winning, or any other politician, from winning the election while they're under indictment or even while they're convicted. Many, many years ago, a famous politician from the Boston area, Joseph (James) Michael Curley, won reelection to the House of Representatives from a jail cell. That can happen. The only question is whether or not the American voters will vote for that to happen." WHITE FLASH (SOUNDBITE) (English) ATTORNEY, MITCHELL EPNER, SAYING: "Donald Trump could lose his right to vote if he were convicted, but he cannot lose his right to run for president and if elected, to serve as president. The Constitution says that there are only a couple of qualifications to be president of the United States. You have to be a natural-born citizen, which he is. You have to be over the age of 35, which he is. Other than that, you can be serving a life sentence for a quadruple homicide, which nobody has alleged Donald Trump has done, and you can be elected president of the United States." WHITE FLASH (SOUNDBITE) (English) ATTORNEY, MITCHELL EPNER, SAYING: "For people who are sick and tired of seeing and hearing Donald Trump, this was bad news because this successful prosecution will embolden prosecutors to continue to go after him. If the Trump Organization had skated on this, which was a pretty open-and-shut case of tax fraud, it would have caused prosecutors to give a real second thought to whether or not Trump, in fact, was impossible to prosecute. I think that the fact that the Trump Organization lost here means that he's going to be in the news for at least the next six to 12 months." WHITE FLASH (SOUNDBITE) (English) ATTORNEY, MITCHELL EPNER, SAYING: "Nobody's going to jail. On January 13th, the question will just be one of dollars and cents. How much does the judge sentence the Trump Organization to pay in fines? And I do not think that the Trump Organization really will suffer, whether that's the maximum $1.6 million or some lesser amount. I'm certain that with all of the legal fees that they've paid, they've paid way more than that amount of money in defending the case. This has never been about the fine for a conviction."
  • Embargoed: 20th December 2022 23:13
  • Keywords: Donald Trump Trump Organization
  • Location: VARIOUS
  • City: VARIOUS
  • Country: US
  • Topics: Crime/Law/Justice,Judicial Process/Court Cases/Court Decisions,North America
  • Reuters ID: LVA002495206122022RP1
  • Aspect Ratio: 16:9
  • Story Text: EDITORS NOTE: PLEASE DOWNLOAD 4926-USA-TRUMP/NEW YORK-TRIAL-FILE AND 4930-USA-TRUMP/NEW YORK-TRIAL FOR MORE B-ROLL AND COURT SKETCHES
    Donald Trump's legal woes deepened on Tuesday (December 6) when his real estate company was found guilty of carrying out a 15-year-long criminal scheme to defraud tax authorities, further coloring the former U.S. president's 2024 re-election campaign.
    "He is on a major losing streak," said attorney Mitchell Epner of Rottenberg Lipman Rich, P.C. in New York. "He is facing not only the guilty (verdict) for the Trump Organization, all of his attempts to stand in the way of the special counsel moving forward in the criminal investigation with regard to the Mar-a-Lago documents have been pushed aside. That case is going to move forward. The investigation by Fani Willis, the Fulton County district attorney down in Georgia, is moving forward. They've been able to get Mark Meadows to have to testify. Senator Lindsey Graham has had to testify. This is the part in 'Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid' where they take a look out and they see the entire Bolivian army arrayed against them."
    Following Tuesday's verdict, the New York state judge set a sentencing date for Jan. 13. The Trump Organization - which operates hotels, golf courses, and other real estates around the world - faces up to $1.6 million in fines over the conviction.
    The company had pleaded not guilty. Trump himself was not charged in the case.
    "Nobody's going to jail," said Epner. "On January 13th, the question will just be one of dollars and cents. How much does the judge sentence the Trump Organization to pay in fines? And I do not think that the Trump Organization really will suffer, whether that's the maximum $1.6 million or some lesser amount. I'm certain that with all of the legal fees that they've paid, they've paid way more than that amount of money in defending the case. This has never been about the fine."
    While the fine is not expected to be material for a company of the Trump Organization's size, the conviction by a jury could complicate its ability to do business by spooking lenders and partners.
    "This is probably an event of default on any loan that any part of the Trump Organization has taken out, which means that any bank could call in that loan," said Epner. "This might require the Trump Organization to scramble to refinance a lot of loans. It also means that the federal government can, but doesn't mean they have to, but the federal government now can break every contract that they have with the Trump Organization, including any contracts for the Secret Service, to stay at Mar-a-Lago or continue to rent a full floor at Trump Tower. There have been a lot of stories about how those rents have been well above market rates and have put millions of dollars each year into the Trump Organization's coffers."
    Allen Weisselberg, the company's former chief financial officer, had pleaded guilty and was required to testify against the Trump Organization as part of his plea agreement.
    A lawyer for the Trump Organization, Alan Futerfas, vowed to appeal the verdict.
    (Production: Dan Fastenberg, Roselle Chen)
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