- Date: 7th June 1995
- Access Restrictions:This media cannot be downloaded as there may be copyright restrictions. Please contact us for more information
- City: CAPE TOWN
- Country: South Africa
- Reuters ID: 95JUN07V03
- Story Text:
SPECIAL PARLIAMENTARY DEBATE re: Mandela'sì
statement to Senate in that he instructed the ANCì
security to protect Shell House even if people areì
to be killed
MANDELA'S SPEECH; REAX FROM DR NDZIMANDE [ANC];ì
HENNIE SMITH [NP] & DEPUTY MINISTER J. MATTHEWS
01.26.57 SPEECH MANDELA
00.01.52 ...it is in the nature of politics thatì
parties should seek to exploit perceived witnesses
in their opponents & if there are none conjur themì
00.02.15 ...we made the statement to the Senate onì
the 1/6/95, not because it was a pleasant thing toì
say. We acknowledge this fact not in order toì
boast about loss of life & we do not for a momentì
consider the President to be above the Law or toì
claim certain priviledges in debates of thisì
00.02.59 ...this matter has on countlessì
occassions been brought before this house...factsì
have been deliberately turned upon their heads inì
pursuit of party-political advantage in aì
well-planned vendetta against the ANC...
00.03.49 REPEATING APPARENT FACTS OF SHELL HOUSEì
00.03.57 ...that the ANC is co-operating with theì
investigators. Our doors are wide open...
00.04.29 ...some parties are not concerned aboutì
black lives...raise their voices in anì
opportunistic way to get the ANC. The Shell Houseì
incident of 28/3/94, was not a bolt from anì
otherwise clear blue sky - the character of whatì
happened, particularly the behaviour of the ANC,ì
was part of a pattern that goes back decades...
00.06.16...we legitimately had to develop theì
people's capacity to self-defence...
00.07.26 Shell House was not a bolt from the blueì
- the period of Feb & March 1994 had witnessed anì
intense campaign by forces bent on sabotaging theì
elections to murder their way to this objective.
00.07.44 RE DEATH TOLL IN KWAZULU-NATAL IN THEì
BUILT-UP OF MARCH 28
00.08.01 WIDE SIDE ANGLE MANDELA SPEECHING
00.08.52 Shell House was not a bolt from the blueì
- before the March on that day, the ANC had infoì
that some of the marchers were to be directed toì
attack Shell House, destroy info & kill members ofì
00.09.15 WIDE HOUSE ...the day before the march weì
had called the then State President, the Nationalì
Commissioner of Police.....and proposed to themì
that roadblocks should be set up, the marchersì
disarmed. All of them agreed.
00.09.33 But as events were to unfold, this wasì
00.10.19 IN THE LIGHT OF THE ABOVE THE PRESIDENTì
ISSUED AN INSTRUCTION and I quote "that if theì
marchers attack the House, they must pls protectì
it even if they had to kill people [APPLAUSE] itì
was absolutely necessary fro me to give thatì
00.10.44 It was absolutely necessary for me toì
give that instruction [SHOUTING ORDER!]
00.10.50 This is nothing more nor less of aì
statement of the Common Law right to self-defence
00.11.05 ...we regret the loss of live anywhereì
and under any circunstances....
00.11.20 ..what would have happened if theì
intentions of these plotters had been realised?
00.12.41 ...evidence...pointed to the colusionì
between elements in the previous gorv & leaders ofì
00.13.28...part of the strategy of low-intensityì
conflict was the propaganda....to portray the NPì
as being clean and above the problems. Nothingì
could be further from the truth. Whatever theì
origins of the IFP may have been, it was adoptedì
by the NP gorv as an instrument to weaken the ANCì
& other democratic forces [APPLAUSE]
00.14.31 RE CABINET MEETING THIS MORNING TOì
ADDRESS VIOLENCE IN NATAL
00.17.05 CUTAWAY BUTHELEZI LISTENING
00.17.34 END SPEECH MANDELA
00.17.39 WS HOUSE APPLAUDING
00.18.40 DR BLADE MDZIMANDE [ANC] SPEECH This onceì
more brings to the fore the best of the NP'sì
hypocrisy, the DP's unashamed opportunism as isì
typical of confused & unprincipled liberals, andì
the IFP's usual tantrums & attempts to findì
anything that will create a state of conflictì
between itself & the ANC...
00.19.18 ...president's statement...should beì
taken in its proper context..
00.20.37 ...it looks everyone else has a right toì
self-defence but this right does not extend to theì
00.21.43 CUTAWAY PIK BOTHA & FW LISTENING
00.22.38 CUTAWAY WIDE BUTHLEZI LISTENING
00.23.42 ...if by statemanship is meant presidingì
over dying people & being indifferent to that asì
the NP & DP are doing...don't need that kind ofì
00.24.04 HOUSE APPLAUDING - SPEAKER SHOUTING ORDER
00.24.19 SPEECH HENNIE SMITH [NP]
00.24.58 ...the President today tried to shift theì
blame referring to the Shell House incident...
00.25.06 ...it is very convenient to place theì
responsibility at the door of other leaders...myì
question is....Should it so happen that Dep Presì
FW de Klerk accepts the responsibility of thisì
action which took place while he held office, willì
you Mr President & even the ANC be prepared toì
take full responsibility of all incidents thatì
have taken place to date & more Sir, will you beì
prepared to endorse similar or other incidentsì
that will be taking place during your term ofì
00.26.21 ...the NP wanted the Law to take itsì
course. The NP wanted the SAPS to benefit of theì
full cause of the investigation...
00.26.48 ..through his lamentable statements inì
the Senate last week, pres Mandela has compelledì
the NP to request a special debate...
00.27.26 ...was your acknowledgement in the Senateì
on 1/6/95, armed at side-tracking the policeì
investigation & report? Is it true that you wereì
afraid that the police investigation will proveì
your involvement in the Shell House saga?
00.27.47 Is it not true that the confession in theì
Senate was aimed at weakening-down the policeì
report by pre-empting it with a confession underì
the Parliamentary priviledge?
00.28.27 ...NP QUESTIONS THE DELAY IN FINALISINGì
00.28.35 CUTAWAY MANDELA LISTENING - AMUSED
00.29.55 HENNIE: Pres Mandela & the ANC are nowì
trying to water down the matter by placing theì
blame for the incident on others & playing it offì
against other incidents during which people alsoì
unfortunately died [ORDER!]
00.30.18 ....the NP weeps over every South Africanì
who dies an innocent death [HOUSE IN UPROAR]...
00.30.36 ...incidents in which the now-presidentsì
of the country issued instructions to shootì
apparently in the absence of thorough reasons, doì
not make a contribution to the calming of emotionsì
& to bringing the innocent deaths in SA undeerì
control - the contrary is true however!
00.31.02 ...NP is now no longer satisfied with theì
progress of the investigation...[ORDER!]
00.31.11 ....with the president squarely involvedì
in the whole matter....NP insists on that theì
Shell House saga calls for a commission of enquiryì
the NP demands that the international community beì
involved in this investigation [ORDER!]...
00.31.46 ....it is the view of the NP that aì
Judicial Commission in the Shell House massacreì
should be conducted...
00.32.06 ...this incident & statements by Mrì
Mandela has the potential to cause an escalationì
in bloodshed in SA...
00.32.47 Why has pres Mandela remained silentì
until now?...is the ANC above the law?
00.33.27 END SPEECH HENNIE SMITH
00.34.21 DEPUTY MINISTER OF SAFETY & SECURITY, JOEì
00.35.38 CUTAWAY MS WINNIE MANDELA
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